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'99 BB6 "nut and bolt" restoration.

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BlackShadow
Posts: 180
Joined: Thu Jun 21, 2012 12:25 am
My Generation: 5G
Location: Whitby. Not THAT Whitby, the other Whitby, the one in Durham. Not THAT Durham, the other Durham.

'99 BB6 "nut and bolt" restoration.

Post by BlackShadow » Mon Apr 15, 2013 8:26 pm

Usually around this time I would be posting my "spring cleaning thread", in which I take the car apart, clean everything, and then put it back together with white gloves on. Well, this year I will be doing that, but before I do, I have a few mechanical loose ends to tie up first. I'll explain why in a later post.

The plan and the parts:

Engine:

- I will be installing Type-S pistons on the current rods.

- I will be using OEM rings, but it would be great if I could find the name of the company who makes them, because Honda want's $400 for them, and they claim there is only one set left in Canada.

- Bearings: I will look at once the engine is opened up. I know some of you are screaming at the screen right now, but if they are within spec (checked with a bore gauge and platigauge against a micrometer blueprinted crank shaft) and in good shape, I'll let sleeping dogs lie. If they show they are getting long in the tooth, I will definitely change them out.

- Gaskets and seals: I had originally put together an order of around $1000 in parts for hondapartschaep.com. Unfortunately they will not ship to Canada anymore, and they won't work with me on the customs declaration, so I will have to 86 that order. I will however see if I can trick them with one of those border shipping places because their prices on certain items can't be beat. I will be changing out all the relevant seals and gaskets. Anything that is, or can start to leak, and that is a pain in the ass to get to once it's in the car.


Head:

- I checked it with a straight edge and feeler gauges, it appears to be within spec. I will be taking it to a machine shop to have it looked at though just to be sure. There are a couple scratches on the mating surface which may have to be milled out. Aside from that, all the work will be done by me. The valvetrain is complete, except for the valves themselves. I will swap out the valves from my current head, and put them in the Type-S head.


Transmission:

- I will be installing the MFactory helical LSD into this. I am hoping to not need shims, but we shall see. Getting them from Honda Canada will be a pain. They want $10 a pop for them, and they are apparently discontinued. I may end up having one made.


Tuning:

- In keeping with the current rip off my government is running, I have to keep the car as stock as possible. The only thing I am planning to have done is having the stock ECU programmed to run the Type-S numbers. I have read that this is possible. I have also read that the stock ECU will adapt to the higher compression pistons and larger cams on it's own. I don't see how that would be entirely possible, or that it would adequately utilize the mechanical advantage of the parts. I will have to look into it further.


Cosmetic stuff:

- The engine bay will be scrubbed down. Any corrosion will be sanded out and primed. The engine bay itself will be painted the stock B92P and have a generous layer of clear coat applied. It will be colour sanded and hopefully will look like the exterior of the car. This will all be done by me.

- Freshly painted wrinkle red valve cover.

- All brackets and hardware will be restored. Polished, painted,or replaced.

- I will be painting and installing a JDM S-Spec mid rise wing.

- The head, block and transmission case will all be polished.

- This is a restoration. Everything will be OEM/JDM/OEM+ There will be no tucking or shaving.



The car:

Year: 1999
Make: Honda
Model: Prelude
Sub-model: Base
Build date: 10/98
Colour: B92P
Engine: H22A4 DOHC VTEC
Transmission: M2Y4 (manual)
Owners: 2
Purchased: September 2004
Purchase KMs: 137000
Current KMs: 199000



Items in RED are wanted.
Items marked with an asterisk are my own work.


Exterior:
OEM front lip.
JDM fog lights.
Putco Jet Yellow fog light bulbs.*
OEM spoiler. (on its way out)
JDM S-spec mid-rise spoiler (painting)*
Refinished belt/window sill moldings.*
OEM back and sides
Body work + new paint
New belt/window sill moldings.


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Hopefully the finished product will look like this:
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1997 Prelude Base (wrecked)
1996 Prelude SR (sold)
1994 Subaru SVX LSi (Sold)

Current:
1999 Prelude Base (S-Spec build in progress)
1990 Nissan 300ZX (weee!)
2011 Ford CVPI (daily)
1957 Cadillac Coupe de Ville

User avatar
BlackShadow
Posts: 180
Joined: Thu Jun 21, 2012 12:25 am
My Generation: 5G
Location: Whitby. Not THAT Whitby, the other Whitby, the one in Durham. Not THAT Durham, the other Durham.

Re: '99 BB6 "nut and bolt" restoration.

Post by BlackShadow » Mon Apr 15, 2013 8:27 pm

Interior:
No base model 3rd brake light.
OEM heated leather seats.
JDM door sills.
JDM Type-S gauge cluster. (modified to work with immobilizer and cruise control lights)*
JDM chrome gauge rings.
JDM ash tray.
JDM cup holder.
OEM carbon fiber (look) trim kit.
JTC customs short shifter.
Type SH shift knob.
Chrome door panel trim.*
Mugen pedals.
Custom made Mugen (style) dead pedal.*
USDM fog light switch and bezel.
Type-S red stitch steering wheel.
EDM cruise control buttons. (waiting to be installed)
EDM red door courtesy lamps. (waiting to be installed)
OEM trunk mat
New floor mats.
Red stitched shift boot.
Red stitched arm rests.
Red stitched [classified at this time] <--you'll have to wait and see.
Padded rear arm rests.
Some form of double din nav set up.



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1997 Prelude Base (wrecked)
1996 Prelude SR (sold)
1994 Subaru SVX LSi (Sold)

Current:
1999 Prelude Base (S-Spec build in progress)
1990 Nissan 300ZX (weee!)
2011 Ford CVPI (daily)
1957 Cadillac Coupe de Ville

User avatar
BlackShadow
Posts: 180
Joined: Thu Jun 21, 2012 12:25 am
My Generation: 5G
Location: Whitby. Not THAT Whitby, the other Whitby, the one in Durham. Not THAT Durham, the other Durham.

Re: '99 BB6 "nut and bolt" restoration.

Post by BlackShadow » Mon Apr 15, 2013 8:28 pm

Engine/transmission/exhaust:
JDM Type-S intake w/K&N filter
Refinished valve cover.*
Neuspeed strut tower bar.
Mugen oil cap.
Mugen reservoir cozies.
Hand polished cylinder head.*
TYPE-S CYLINDER HEAD (hand polished) (awaiting installation)
TYPE-S CAMS (awaiting installation)
Hand polished heat shield.* (no longer required)
Hand polished reservoir bracket.*
Hand polished battery tie down.*
Hand polished radiator supports.*
Hand polished lift ring.*
All under hood paint de-swirled, buffed, and waxed.*
Refinished OEM horns.*
OBX twin loop 2.5" muffler.
Vibrant 14" x 2.5" resonator.
Magnaflow high flow cat 2.5"
Hytech replica exhaust manifold.
2.5" tig welded, mandrel bend stainless steel piping.
JDM M2B4 LSD (rebuilding) (for sale soon)
MFactory helical LSD


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1997 Prelude Base (wrecked)
1996 Prelude SR (sold)
1994 Subaru SVX LSi (Sold)

Current:
1999 Prelude Base (S-Spec build in progress)
1990 Nissan 300ZX (weee!)
2011 Ford CVPI (daily)
1957 Cadillac Coupe de Ville

User avatar
BlackShadow
Posts: 180
Joined: Thu Jun 21, 2012 12:25 am
My Generation: 5G
Location: Whitby. Not THAT Whitby, the other Whitby, the one in Durham. Not THAT Durham, the other Durham.

Re: '99 BB6 "nut and bolt" restoration.

Post by BlackShadow » Mon Apr 15, 2013 8:29 pm

Wheels/brakes/suspension:

Type SH wheels with red centre caps.
Stock suspension.
Freshly installed ATE brake rotors and pads.*
Painted calipers *

Image
1997 Prelude Base (wrecked)
1996 Prelude SR (sold)
1994 Subaru SVX LSi (Sold)

Current:
1999 Prelude Base (S-Spec build in progress)
1990 Nissan 300ZX (weee!)
2011 Ford CVPI (daily)
1957 Cadillac Coupe de Ville

User avatar
BlackShadow
Posts: 180
Joined: Thu Jun 21, 2012 12:25 am
My Generation: 5G
Location: Whitby. Not THAT Whitby, the other Whitby, the one in Durham. Not THAT Durham, the other Durham.

Re: '99 BB6 "nut and bolt" restoration.

Post by BlackShadow » Mon Apr 15, 2013 8:30 pm

December 2012: I check the oil and notice it's a touch low, so I go to top her up and noticed:

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A milky coating on the inside of the oil cap. Uh oh. Unfortunately, because of the timing of this discovery, looking at the

tail pipe wouldn't tell me anything (every car makes white smoke in the winter). The oil on the dip stick was deep amber,

and the coolant looked great. Nothing to worry about, right?


Compression test:


Cylinder 1: Looks alright.
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Cylinder 2: Looks good too.
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Cylinder 3: What the..?
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Repeats tests on cylinders 2 and 3.



Cylinder 4: A picture is starting to take shape.
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Low, but equal compression in two neighbouring cylinders. Any guesses?


- Bad block? What are the odds of both cylinders going at the same time, and the drop being identical?

- Bad valves? What are the odds on having an equal compression drop on two neighbouring cylinders? 8 valves leaking the same amount?

- Bad rings/ring gaps: Again, what are the odds of both cylinders having the rings let go, or ring gaps meet up and allow an equal drop in compression?

These all seem pretty remote to me.


The most probable cause in my mind is a head gasket leak between the two cylinders. Normally at this point, I would run a leakdown test, but I was planning a rebuild on this motor anyways, so I am going to pull her out and do a visual diagnosis of the internals.

I'm going to take you along for the ride, in this thread, and in videos. All of the parts I use, I will review, along with my experience with the companies that I purchased them from.
1997 Prelude Base (wrecked)
1996 Prelude SR (sold)
1994 Subaru SVX LSi (Sold)

Current:
1999 Prelude Base (S-Spec build in progress)
1990 Nissan 300ZX (weee!)
2011 Ford CVPI (daily)
1957 Cadillac Coupe de Ville

User avatar
BlackShadow
Posts: 180
Joined: Thu Jun 21, 2012 12:25 am
My Generation: 5G
Location: Whitby. Not THAT Whitby, the other Whitby, the one in Durham. Not THAT Durham, the other Durham.

Re: '99 BB6 "nut and bolt" restoration.

Post by BlackShadow » Mon Apr 15, 2013 8:34 pm

Lets begin!

Grab your wrenches and start ripping stuff out.

Whoa, slow down turbo! There's some things you should know if you're going to do a job like this. You have to plan it down to the smallest detail. Once you get the engine out, where are you going to put it? Do you have all the tools you need? Can you get the parts you want? Are they on backorder? ....like my friggin' Type-S pistons?

Do you have all the resources you need? Helms manual? Service documents?


I have planned planned this build for years. The final stage of planning and visualization has been going on since December. You can't go into something like this, half cocked. Stuff will go wrong no matter how thoroughly you plan the job, out, but being meticulous will cut down on surprises.





A couple of months ago, I picked up a power steering pump and alternator bracket from Eric at Teknotik. They were off of a scrap engine and rusted to buggery so he let me have them for free (thanks Eric).

Why am I talking about brackets that were never on the car? Well, simple. You have to pace yourself and use your time wisely. While you're waiting for parts, work on something else. When i can't be out in the garage, due to weather or because it's late, I bring in small items and work on them in the house. This way progress continues, and these little odds and ends are done and ready to install when the bigger jobs are done.


Back to the brackets...

This is what I was faced with:
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You could deal with this one of four ways:

1) Say to hell with it and put them on the car as is. (LEAVE this thread now!)
2) Paint over the rust. (Why don't you just stick a knife through my heart?)
3) Grind, sand, wire wheel the rust away.
4) Use a chemical rust remover.


This stuff works like a charm: (not sure if you can get it in the UK or not. if you can, it's good)
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Normally I'm pretty old school, and go the way of grinding and scraping. I don't tend to spend money on stuff to do what I can do for free, but I caved in and gave this stuff a shot. I was surprised. It was ~$9.00 from Canadian Tire, which isn't bad, and it really works!

What you do is you soak the part you are working on in this stuff. You can either submerge it, or paint it on. Leave the stuff to soak for a while, and, when you get back, it will be covered in this purplish crust. Supposedly, you can paint right over it, but I wasn't taking any chances. Paint isn't cheap, and the time it takes to properly prep a part, only to find out it looks like crap, is time wasted. I used some steel wool and rubbed the crusty stuff off, and to my surprise, the brackets were a nice iron gray, with a couple black spots on them where the rust had been. I repeated the process a couple times and more of the black spots came off.

When I felt it wouldn't get any better, I thoroughly cleaned the brackets with soap and water. I dried them and immediately shot them with Duplicolor black caliper paint. The results were great!

Brackets hanging in my paint booth:
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After they dried, I brought them back in and had a closer look. They were flawless. I was really impressed with how they turned out.


I then turned my eyes to the hardware. The fasteners looked pretty grungy, so I set to cleaning those up. I just used some steel wool and a dental pick and they came up like brand new. While While I was at it, I polished the adjustment piece for the PS pump. Yes, I did this by hand. No, it didn't take that long. It was done with a file to take out the large imperfections, and then some old sand paper which had ween well worn. It polished the surface to a mirror shine. I will shoot this with some clear coat to protect it from rusting in the future.


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With the polished Type-S head:
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Other bracketry I have been working on:

Hand polishing:
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1997 Prelude Base (wrecked)
1996 Prelude SR (sold)
1994 Subaru SVX LSi (Sold)

Current:
1999 Prelude Base (S-Spec build in progress)
1990 Nissan 300ZX (weee!)
2011 Ford CVPI (daily)
1957 Cadillac Coupe de Ville

User avatar
BlackShadow
Posts: 180
Joined: Thu Jun 21, 2012 12:25 am
My Generation: 5G
Location: Whitby. Not THAT Whitby, the other Whitby, the one in Durham. Not THAT Durham, the other Durham.

Re: '99 BB6 "nut and bolt" restoration.

Post by BlackShadow » Mon Apr 15, 2013 8:35 pm

Some more work on brackets and small stuff...


Gather up all the parts you will be working on, and keep the hardware organized. I recommend using zip lock bags.

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This fellow lives under the air box and isn't normally seen. This part is having the rust nuked with the Rust Check liquid, and it will then get a coat of silver paint. Even though it isn't seen, rust on any part is a bad thing, so take care of it.

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This holds a solenoid on the drivers side shock tower. This part is highly visible and always bothered me. I originally considered polishing it, but it has some tricky areas. I elected to clean it up with the Rust Check liquid and shoot it with the same caliper paint as the PS pump and alternator brackets. It turned out horrendous. The paint fish eyed and went lumpy on the outside face of the bracket. The inside turned out great for some reason. Steel wooled the paint off the outside and am prepared to give it another shot. The inside, although looking great, isn't highly visible, so a less than 10 appearance would be okay by me, especially since it isn't a stock finish being applied. Sometimes this stuff happens and you have to go back to the drawing board. Keep plucking away at it.
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Yes... I do go this far..

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- Small file. One light stroke on each face of the head, so take off the corrosion. Don't over do it, because you'll change the size!
- Steel wool for the top of the head and threads. A wire wheel would work too.
- Soak in Rust Check.
- Steel wool.

It's getting there...
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1997 Prelude Base (wrecked)
1996 Prelude SR (sold)
1994 Subaru SVX LSi (Sold)

Current:
1999 Prelude Base (S-Spec build in progress)
1990 Nissan 300ZX (weee!)
2011 Ford CVPI (daily)
1957 Cadillac Coupe de Ville

User avatar
BlackShadow
Posts: 180
Joined: Thu Jun 21, 2012 12:25 am
My Generation: 5G
Location: Whitby. Not THAT Whitby, the other Whitby, the one in Durham. Not THAT Durham, the other Durham.

Re: '99 BB6 "nut and bolt" restoration.

Post by BlackShadow » Mon Apr 15, 2013 8:36 pm

My plans call for removing the bumper and fenders. This will make it easier to paint the bay and core support thoroughly. It also allows me to work around the front end without worrying about damaging the paint or panels. Fluids are going to be spilled, and an engine is going to be pulled, so I want all finished surfaces removed if possible.

Another reason for the fender removal will be discussed later on in this post, but you probably just want to see the gory details, so here's some pics!

I started by removing small pieces that were easy to access. Things like lights, intake/airbox, brackets etc. I highly recommend taking as many pictures as possible of EVERYTHING. This way you can refer to them if you run into a problem.

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To remove the bumper you will need to remove the splash shields under the front of the car. No lie, this was a total pain in the ass. All of the fasteners were heavily corroded. I twisted the head off of one completely. Although being soaked in WD40, the rest came out a quarter turn at a time, allowing a second or two to cool off before turning them another quarter turn. Those who have used a die to cut threads will understand this procedure. Most still came out, warm or hot to the touch. Take it slow, or you will twist the heads off of the fasteners, or stretch the threaded portions.

Another problem I had with the splash shields were those folded clip things that hold two pieces of plastic together. The fasteners were seized solid in those, and the entire clip would turn, chewing the bejesus out of the splash shield. There was one on each side of the bumper that I completely destroyed the holes they went through. I will have to go back and fix those with washers.

The fasteners that hold the fender liners in can also be tricky. Prying on the button in the middle of them made a couple disintegrate. I can buy more of these, but if you try this, be careful. All fasteners were put in a ziplock bag and labeled.

I brought the fender liners and the splash shield inside and washed them down with some Mean Green. They came up pretty good.

[Picture coming soon]

The next step was to get the bumper off. Again, I ran into some problems. On each edge of the bumper, where it meets the wheel well opening, there is a screw. The passenger side screw came out just fine. The driver's side was happy where it was. It turned and turned but wouldn't come out. I pulled back the fender liner (this was before I removed them), and saw the screw had this little plastic clip on it. When I turned the screw, the clip turned as well. What I ended up doing was having my girl Stancie gently pull the bumper cover down a bit, while I inserted a pair of needle nose pliers between the top of the bumper cover, and the bottom of the fender. I clasped the clip with the pliers and turned the screw. It eventually came right out. The clip was missing a lot of the little spikes it originally had as a result of my efforts to get it out, BUT the base of the clip did such a good job of holding the screw in, I might just reuse it.

The grille has to be removed in order to reach the push pin clips that hold the central portion. Once the splash guard is gone and the grille is removed, you can pull firmly on the sides of the bumper (above the markers). There are two side clips that will make a nice little pop as they let go. I urge you to use firm pressure, ramped up slowly to overcome the clips. They are plastic. Old plastic. Old plastic that has been exposed to heat and cold for many years. If you jerk them they could crack. If you crack them, you now have the infamous FRONT BUMPER SAG, so be warned.

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Once the bumper is free, you can pull it forward, and away from the car. Watch out for the styrofoam bumper underneath. It may want to fall off when the cover is removed. Put it, and the plastic mounting pieces on the back of it somewhere safe. You now have the metal "rebar" exposed. You can now remove the headlights if you wish. There are measurements for aiming the headlights, and you must make them on the rebar.

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In order to remove the fenders, you must remove the side skirts or sills. They make this sound easy. Trust me, it isn't. There are push pin style fasteners under the floor pan of the car that must first be removed. Then there is a screw in the front wheel well that you have to take out. In my case, I had to take off the mud flap. You then have to slide the whole skirt/sill forward, towards the front of the car. DO NOT PULL OUTWARD ON THE SILL! The clips are SLIDE CLIPS and pulling outward will snap them off. Sliding the sill forward is not easy. Well, it wasn't in my case. Fifteen years of crap was holding them in place. I used a long johnson bar between the back tire and the back of the sill to slip it forward.

[Picture coming soon]

Finally, its time to remove the fenders. This isn't easy either. There are two bolts at bottom of the fender, under the door. There is another up by the mirror. There are three that run along the sill (you can see these with the hood open). Then there are two on the front of the fender, above where the marker light is. One of the last two was sent by the devil himself. These bolts have all been painted over at the factory, so they require a bit of torque to get them to pop free. The biggest problem I had with the fenders was the bolt closest to the wheel well, above where the marker light would be. This bolt is on a flimsy peninsula of sheet metal, and bolts up to another flimsy tab that tuns to the inner fender/engine bay. A wiring harness is clipped to this as well. This bolt was corroded, and wouldn't turn. The tab it goes through is so flimsy, it began to twist and buckle. I could see the fender beginning to flex, so I unbolted both tabs from the inside of the engine bay. This was a pain because the ABS module is right there, and I couldn't get a socket on there.

The fenders are just stamped sheet metal. You can warp them if you pull on them, or store them with weight on them. Be careful when working with them.

[Picture coming soon]

Fender removed:
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This is the OTHER reason I wanted to take the fenders off:
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Note the rust on the spot welds. I didn't know it was there, but spotting it early, means I can fix it with little work involved.


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My car hasn't been winter driven in a few years. When I wash it, I always take care to spray out the wheel wells carefully. Even with that care, you can see the amount of rust that has formed. I am glad I found this when I did. I can fix it easily. This is one of the reasons I do the "spring clean" and take the car apart. It isn't just because I am OCD and love having a clean car. When I take things off, I am inspecting them. I could have done this rebuild without removing the fenders, but I wouldn't know what was going on under them.

I highly recommend having a snoop 'round your cars and see what you can find. A new leak, a spot of rust under the spare tire, corroding connections etc.
Last edited by BlackShadow on Mon Apr 15, 2013 8:45 pm, edited 1 time in total.
1997 Prelude Base (wrecked)
1996 Prelude SR (sold)
1994 Subaru SVX LSi (Sold)

Current:
1999 Prelude Base (S-Spec build in progress)
1990 Nissan 300ZX (weee!)
2011 Ford CVPI (daily)
1957 Cadillac Coupe de Ville

User avatar
BlackShadow
Posts: 180
Joined: Thu Jun 21, 2012 12:25 am
My Generation: 5G
Location: Whitby. Not THAT Whitby, the other Whitby, the one in Durham. Not THAT Durham, the other Durham.

Re: '99 BB6 "nut and bolt" restoration.

Post by BlackShadow » Mon Apr 15, 2013 8:38 pm

Not much of an update today I'm afraid. That rust I found was annoying me so much I decided to have a prod at it today. And prod, I did. The metal had started to scale and flake, so I used a screwdriver to rake the loose material away. I was glad to see that the thickness of the metal wasn't diminished all that much.

I grabbed my trusty wire wheel and began chipping away at what was left. It wasn't easy though, I don't have an angle die grinder, and wire wheels aren't the best for doing this kind of work. I got some parts of it down to bare metal though. It isn't pretty, but as long as the rust is gone, I don't care what it looks like. It isn't a visible are of the car.

After wire wheeling the rust down to bare metal, I grabbed some coarse sandpaper and gave it a rub with that, then went back to the wire wheel, just to make sure.

Finishing up for the night, I didn't have any primer or anything to cover the sections of bare metal, so I grabbed my bottle of Rust Check and wiped all the rust spots with it. Within an hour, they had all turned purple and crusted over. Tomorrow, I will wire wheel it off and see what I'm left with.

Pictures!

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1997 Prelude Base (wrecked)
1996 Prelude SR (sold)
1994 Subaru SVX LSi (Sold)

Current:
1999 Prelude Base (S-Spec build in progress)
1990 Nissan 300ZX (weee!)
2011 Ford CVPI (daily)
1957 Cadillac Coupe de Ville

User avatar
BlackShadow
Posts: 180
Joined: Thu Jun 21, 2012 12:25 am
My Generation: 5G
Location: Whitby. Not THAT Whitby, the other Whitby, the one in Durham. Not THAT Durham, the other Durham.

Re: '99 BB6 "nut and bolt" restoration.

Post by BlackShadow » Mon Apr 15, 2013 8:42 pm

I killed my 4th die grinder doing this work. This last one had been babied and still locked up. Piece of jobby.

I grabbed my trusty electric rotary tool, which is a beyond discount brand of Dremel, and set to work. I thought it too would crap out, since it's meant for guys in cardigans working on bird feeders and train sets, but it worked great!


I just used a stone and ground the rust off. In the last pictures you can see a few dark specs. These are pits in the metal. I don't want to grind away too much metal in case it weakens the structure. What I will do is look into some rust converting primer or something. before packing up for the night I soaked the entire area with that Rust Check stuff again to kill off anything I may have missed.

A few days ago:
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Today:
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Before:
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Today:
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1997 Prelude Base (wrecked)
1996 Prelude SR (sold)
1994 Subaru SVX LSi (Sold)

Current:
1999 Prelude Base (S-Spec build in progress)
1990 Nissan 300ZX (weee!)
2011 Ford CVPI (daily)
1957 Cadillac Coupe de Ville

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