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Breed manipulation: what's your view?

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Donald
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Post by Donald » Sat Apr 21, 2012 7:07 pm

Thanks guys, it's all helpful stuff :)

littlefeller wrote:changing anything not intended is wrong, evalution should not be messed with, it has taken millions of years to get where it is now, dont mess with it :ugeek:
Just to clarify though, littlefeller, you're implying evolution is a predetermined path, and that animals today are how they are through intelligent design? :?: :?

4thgenphil wrote:just look and norfolk for an example of this ! where do you think the phrase normal for norfolk came from ;)
Is normal for Norfolk 6 toes, webbed feet and calling wasps Jasper? :lol:


I think maybe any future answers should not bring evolution into it as it doesn't really play a role in this at all. The breeds we have today are there on purpose, most arriving within the last 500 years.

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Post by Donald » Sat Apr 21, 2012 7:08 pm

4thgenphil wrote:can you get that in you assignment gorgon and maybe cite LG?
I suppose I will have to list this on my references! :lol: I think I'll just put that it was a public survey... imagine if my work was IV'd and they came here and found the NSFW section ;)

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Post by littlefeller » Sat Apr 21, 2012 7:25 pm

no im not implying that, however evolution doesnt as darwin thought develop slowly over milenia, rather takes large strides in a very very short time with large gaps of remaining static, usually brought on by a catastrofic change in enviroment, so my thoughts on delibratly changing gene pools or altering there course is very wrong and dangerous.
so my answer to the question is no, although the nsfw section would get more members :lol:

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Post by Crazy_C » Sat Apr 21, 2012 7:26 pm

I've been around dogs all my life, and having been a dog sledder and a snowboarder who has been rescued by a St. Bernard before (no, there wasn't brandy in the barrel but rather a phone, a GPS transmitter, some sort of food bar, and a thermal blanket, I was very disappointed.

It is a common misconception that huskies are a breed, but infact, they are a constantly changing cross of breeds for the traits of strength, speed, endurance, long hair to keep warm and resilience to the cold. When I was sledding, there were always people in the bar discussing what cross of breeds made the best husky. There is one guy I know who is probably the most anal guy when it comes to husky breeding who won't breed 2 huskies as the traits from the original breeds will get diminished through breeding huskies together. He has one husky that's in it's 20's and still strong and healthy :shock:

St. Bernards are probably the most famous breed that was manipulated specifically for mountain search and rescue. The long hair, endurance to the cold, strength and stamina along with it's senses were all bred into it specifically for trapsing through the snow and finding people who are lost.


Breed manipulation like this, I believe is perfectly fine, and I encourage it.




However, breeding things like a chipoo (chiwawa poodle mix) to be like a poodle, but smaller and cuter, I don't agree with as they have so many issues it's just cruel and unfair in my opinion. Don't breed dogs to make a smaller version of another breed as people who do this generally don't take health complications into consideration.
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Post by RattyMcClelland » Sat Apr 21, 2012 8:51 pm

Crazy_C wrote:However, breeding things like a chipoo (chiwawa poodle mix) to be like a poodle, but smaller and cuter, I don't agree with as they have so many issues it's just cruel and unfair in my opinion.
Shipoopi shipoopi.... :lol:
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Post by Gayno » Sat Apr 21, 2012 8:57 pm

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Post by 2lude » Sun Apr 22, 2012 9:43 am

This is Alfie a staff crossed with an akita now I'm not a fan if staffs as said above pedigree means in bread and wrong I will always take a mongrel any day as at least your adding a bigger gene pool so hopefully get less breed problems

Alfie wouldn't be a choice of breed for me personally but I love him to bits regardless

What I do however get is people asking about him and what breed he is because he's so lovable a mention staff and bang their gone

As for staffs I would never a have one my self but this is down to personal experience and no repuTATION and I won't avoid them ill always say hell to them



It's how they are brought up not the breed its the owners not the animal that make a good bad dog

Their are times like the picture below were I could kill him as he eat the sofa bed however its my own fault for not walking him enough so he git bored and lonely


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Post by Ted » Sun Apr 22, 2012 10:13 am

i have a staff lab cross that was bought purely for his colours, used to have a doberman that died of heart failure at only 6 years of age and the mrs will never have another pure breed. bailey the staff lab cross has doberman colourings but is slightly chunkier and often gets mistaken for a rottie but hopefully will live a lot longer than 6 years.
so slightly confused myself now as to whats good and whats bad, surely if you want something to live a long time then breed it with something different but isn't that the same as a labradoodle for instance ?

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Post by A1ex » Sun Apr 22, 2012 10:14 am

Breed manipulation is an alteration of natural selection, by changing survival of the fittest to survival of the cutest it's diluting it's pushing the animals evolution in a different direction to how it occurs naturally.

Trouble is, man has been doing this since they first met wolves 15,000 years ago and all breeds of commonly known dogs have been bred from traits. They have a foxtwo gene (I think it was called) which speeds up evolution between generations which is how there are so many types of dogs in what is a relatively short space of time.

Nothing against what has been done, I love dogs, however when the change has been pushed too far that the breed cannot survive without mans intervention (chiwowas can only give birth by c section) or they have a poor quality of life and can't breath properly for example them it's gone too far.

I saw an experiment on animal domestication before, through selective breeding they'd domesticated a bloody line of foxes in 6 generatons. Not exactly dogs, but it's an interesting fact :) well I thnk it is
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Post by 2lude » Sun Apr 22, 2012 10:33 am

I saw that in 6 generations the foxs had fluffy tails and dog/cat traits very interesting

As for breeding then depends on the results my dog is bigger than a staff curly akita tail and seems a going mix the down side is he is short haired but 2 layers and he malts all the time but he seems healthy and happy

However their is the chance you can breed both genetic flaws from each breed
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