2.2VTI Motegi 4WS?

[MikePennell94]

Hi, recently bought a 2.2 motegi (UKDM) and I've been trying to test the 4WS (did this model come 4ws?) But the 4ws light doesn't come on when turning the key in the ignition (which apparently it shpuld for about 4sec. According to manual) nor do the back wheels turn when stationary but full locked either side? Any help or guidance would be appreciated!

[Jackson Bondy]

If the light does not come on when turning the ignition, have you checked the bulb is present?

It is quite common to see people remove the bulb when they have issues with the system. Once the bulb is replaced you can then pull the error codes and go from there.

[MikePennell94]

If the light does not come on when turning the ignition, have you checked the bulb is present?

It is quite common to see people remove the bulb when they have issues with the system. Once the bulb is replaced you can then pull the error codes and go from there.

Thanks mate. Having the petrol gauge looked at om Tuesday so I'll bring it up with the garage.

Does 4ws generally cause a few issues on the 5g?

[Scott560]

It's normally a resilient system. Given you're low mileage it might have seized up a little through lack of use. Hopefully it will free up with some use.

The 4ws is supposed to operate even when stationary with the engine running.

The light should come on when the ignition first goes on. It sounds very much like the bulb was removed to pass the MOT I suspect. It might be worth noting if the bulb is blown or removed and take it up with the seller. Perhaps film the dash cluster removal, if its absent that is evidence of foul play. Might get some money back on it if dishonesty is involved.

There is a 'simple' reset procedure, sometimes the car can throw an error when the battery gets a little flat. Most people don't know how to reset it so resort to removing the bulb.

The reset procedure is (from memory)

1) short out the 2pin connector to the left of the radio, behind the dorito shaped carpet piece (it just pulls off).
2) turn on ignition, do not start the engine
3) When the 4ws light stops flashing it's code. turn the steering wheel 45degrees to the right. The 4ws light comes on
4) Turn the wheel back to dead ahead, 4ws light goes off
5) Turn the wheel to the right 45 degrees, the 4ws light comes on
6) turn back to middle again, I think the light goes off, and then flashes twice.
7) Turn off ignition, remove jumper wire
start the car, light should come on as expected, then go off.

All of the above takes only about 15 seconds tops. It might be easier to overinflate the front tyres a little, or try and jack the car up at the front, as hefting the wheel 45degrees with no PAS is a bit of workout.

That's all from memory, I haven't had to do it for about 6 years now. It happened a few times on my pre facelift 5th gen when ever I stalled it whilst parking. The facelift one I have now has never thrown the light, despite stalling occasionally in the same manner.

I know the 4th gens sometimes suffered from 'cold' cracked solder joints in the 4ws ECU which was an easy enough fix with a beefy soldering iron. I'm not sure I have read of the 5th gen suffering the same fate. Pretty sure you will be able to find a spare 4ws ecu here (Might even have one myself).

If you do have a bulb fitted, check the ECU is fitted in the rear right of the boot behind the carboard/fabric boot liner. I guess someone could have removed it as easier than removing the bulb!

If you have a genuine fault (other than stiffness/low battery), the 4ws light will blink a code pointing to any logged faults. Sensors can fail etc.

[Andyjess666]

I have same car as you but in a auto never had a issue with my 4ws or auto box

[MikePennell94]

It's normally a resilient system. Given you're low mileage it might have seized up a little through lack of use. Hopefully it will free up with some use.

The 4ws is supposed to operate even when stationary with the engine running.

The light should come on when the ignition first goes on. It sounds very much like the bulb was removed to pass the MOT I suspect. It might be worth noting if the bulb is blown or removed and take it up with the seller. Perhaps film the dash cluster removal, if its absent that is evidence of foul play. Might get some money back on it if dishonesty is involved.

There is a 'simple' reset procedure, sometimes the car can throw an error when the battery gets a little flat. Most people don't know how to reset it so resort to removing the bulb.

The reset procedure is (from memory)

1) short out the 2pin connector to the left of the radio, behind the dorito shaped carpet piece (it just pulls off).
2) turn on ignition, do not start the engine
3) When the 4ws light stops flashing it's code. turn the steering wheel 45degrees to the right. The 4ws light comes on
4) Turn the wheel back to dead ahead, 4ws light goes off
5) Turn the wheel to the right 45 degrees, the 4ws light comes on
6) turn back to middle again, I think the light goes off, and then flashes twice.
7) Turn off ignition, remove jumper wire
start the car, light should come on as expected, then go off.

All of the above takes only about 15 seconds tops. It might be easier to overinflate the front tyres a little, or try and jack the car up at the front, as hefting the wheel 45degrees with no PAS is a bit of workout.

That's all from memory, I haven't had to do it for about 6 years now. It happened a few times on my pre facelift 5th gen when ever I stalled it whilst parking. The facelift one I have now has never thrown the light, despite stalling occasionally in the same manner.

I know the 4th gens sometimes suffered from 'cold' cracked solder joints in the 4ws ECU which was an easy enough fix with a beefy soldering iron. I'm not sure I have read of the 5th gen suffering the same fate. Pretty sure you will be able to find a spare 4ws ecu here (Might even have one myself).

If you do have a bulb fitted, check the ECU is fitted in the rear right of the boot behind the carboard/fabric boot liner. I guess someone could have removed it as easier than removing the bulb!

If you have a genuine fault (other than stiffness/low battery), the 4ws light will blink a code pointing to any logged faults. Sensors can fail etc.

Okay mate thanks, the guy I've bought it from wasn't the original owner but had it at a garage instead (seems like a stand up guy, even as a salesman (lol)) It was actually him who mentioned a few things he had noticed as he was about to sell to me so he's paying for the things that need fixing put of his pocket so I'll mention it to him.

I'll try that procedure tomorrow and hope for the best but I'm assuming that the light has either been removed or has blown so I'll get the garage to look at it on Tuesday (I'm not very mechanically minded so i don't want to get too involved lest I break something further)

I'll keep the thread updated! Even without 4ws she handles like a beauty!

[Scott560]

I'll try that procedure tomorrow and hope for the best

If the light doesn't come on, you will not be able to do the reset procedure. You need to see the light come on and off to know when to move the steering wheel.

You will need to check the ECU is physically there, and the bulb is working before you try the reset procedure.

[wurlycorner]

did this model come 4ws?

Just to answer this question (lots of helpful info posted by others on diagnosis etc)... Yes, all UKDM VTEC 5th gens came with 4ws.
Agree with others, if the bulb isn't coming on, it's probably blown or been removed.
It's *possible* that someone has done a 2WS conversion on it by removing the rack and fitting a 2WS sub-frame from the 2.0 model - easy enough to decipher by looking under the rear of the car.

2WS rear suspension parts diagram;


4WS rear steering parts diagram;

(items 21-3-8 in there replace item 19 on the 2WS diagram and you have item 11 as a big lump in the middle of the car in the sub-frame)

[MikePennell94]

did this model come 4ws?

Just to answer this question (lots of helpful info posted by others on diagnosis etc)... Yes, all UKDM VTEC 5th gens came with 4ws.
Agree with others, if the bulb isn't coming on, it's probably blown or been removed.
It's *possible* that someone has done a 2WS conversion on it by removing the rack and fitting a 2WS sub-frame from the 2.0 model - easy enough to decipher by looking under the rear of the car.

2WS rear suspension parts diagram;


4WS rear steering parts diagram;

(items 21-3-8 in there replace item 19 on the 2WS diagram and you have item 11 as a big lump in the middle of the car in the sub-frame)

Interesting. Why would someone want to remove the 4ws? Would there be any benefit in that?

[Scott560]

Interesting. Why would someone want to remove the 4ws? Would there be any benefit in that?

It's a complicated system which can throw a warning light on a dashboard, making the car unpassable to MOT and therefore unsaleable.

It can also be removed for weight purposes if the owner wished for extra performance. The 4ws is very useful for parking, but it's benefit is not so noticeable on the race track (or at least it wasn't to me on the laps I did it working vs laps with it not working).